It’s probably impossible to be neutral about China

The other day, I was watching a lecture by the former Singaporean foreign minister George Yeo when waiting for dinner to start at my parents’ home. He was talking about Europe’s position in a world where China is ascending.

My Mum sat next to me, and as she watched, she frowned.

“Why are you watching this? Interesting meh?”

“It’s my current obsession.”

“I thought last time you were crazy about gardening. Now you want to know about China politics? Don’t you think there are better things to think about?” she tuts.

We both shrugged and I continued to watch George Yeo debunk the commonly held beliefs Europeans had about China while my mum complained about how boring the lecture was.

Not the lecture I was talking about, but a good one nevertheless. Because the interviewer wasn’t condescending or constantly interrupting!


I get obsessed about topics, and there’s no common thread to my topical obsessions. At one point I was obsessed with jewellery making. Then I quickly got bored and moved on to plagues and vaccines. And then it was the Indie Web.

You get the idea. I find many things interesting and this unique trait has helped me greatly in my career, even the one beyond journalism.

But none of my topical obsessions would get me in trouble or paint me in a bad light like my obsession with China.

Or rather, my obsession with the current Western narrative of China and how it is so different from my South-East Asian one.

I am aware that if I write about this, especially on Western-dominated media or platforms (which is, I realised, almost everything), I’ll probably be flamed, viewed with disdain and scorn, lose friends or have my real life impacted in some way. I mean, it’s not “probably” but more like “guaranteed”, based on my experience on Mastodon.

And that’s pretty disturbingโ€”realising that many people will misunderstand and dislike me automatically just because I hold a different view of a topic they feel passionately about.

They don’t understand China

But my problem is that while they feel passionately about China, many don’t know China.

Their lack of understanding and virulent refusal to fix that disturb me greatly. The fact that so many are unaware that they’re being driven to accept and endorse yet another American war despite repeated incidences in the past, is exasperating. But most of all, having to grit my teeth as I endure, at the risk of sounding dramatic, racist microaggressions and condescension from what I thought were level-headed people is stressful.

Mind you, if war does spark between China and America, South-East Asia will be the battleground. I picture war ravaging this region while armchair Americans, safe in their continent thousands of miles away in their suburbs, lecture us about human rights. Pah!

So yes, each anti-China post makes me afraid, because America’s people are so ignorant about the consequences of their “moral high ground”.

The desperate search for nuance

In a drive to understand what the hell was happening, I read more about this topic.

After a while, I decided that Western publications and thought leaders were just hopeless sources of information about China. They often speak without understanding the nuances of Chinese history and culture. Their thoughts are: “China is not like us, refuses to be like us, so must be evil.”

They quote the human rights abuses of China but refuse to acknowledge that their country is not spotless either. Worse of all, they (their leaders and people!) dared to lecture the world on how to behave better when they alone couldn’t manage their countries or lock away the black ops bases. The lack of clarity, arrogance and hypocrisy drives me crazy!

So, I moved towards more pro-China content such as CGTN, and Youtube channels like Reports on China and Cyrus Jannsen. Watching CGTN was educational but quite disturbing because it was well, jingoistic at times. (Not unlike American patriotic flag-waving moments in movies and documentaries!)

Now, I appreciate the efforts of these pro-China Youtubers and what they’re trying to do, but they too, lack nuance. To be blunt, they’re viewing China through the lens of a privileged white expat, and try as they might – and even if they have Chinese spousesโ€”they will never experience China the way ordinary Chinese people do.

Chinese people rarely tell foreigners the entire truth about their experiences. Fear of being labelled “anti-government” is probably one of them, but there’s also this “they won’t understand and I’m not going to bother telling them” thing that even we Malaysians have when Westerners speak glowingly about Malaysia and ask us if we liked our country or not. Most Chinese are also aware of anti-China sentiments in the West and would rather die (okay, probably an exaggeration but not far from the truth) than let their quote be a contributor to that.

So, I travelled closer to home and found a more comfortable middle ground in South-East Asian thought leaders and media outlets like Channel News Asia.

As I listen and read the works of South-East Asian diplomats like Kishore Mahbubani, George Yeo, and London-based economist Keyu Jin, I am a little relieved to find my thoughts reflected in theirs. Oh, phew, I’m not mad, or a despot, for thinking these thoughts. To quote Mastodonians: “I’m not a fascist!”

To my relief, these people do point out flaws in China: Its declining birth rate, autocratic tendencies which can impact innovation, and geopolitical mistakes of the past and present. And while pro-China enthusiasts trumpet China’s great economy, even now, Jin said that China’s economy is not great.

Personally, I think China’s form of governance is great only because they lucked out with their bunch of leaders. If they had a Putin or any despot in the seat of power, it’s not gonna be easy for anyone. But judging from China’s history: dynasties fall and rise, and this will be no different. Mandate of Heaven and all.

Basically, the philosophy underpinning the Mandate of Heaven is: The emperor is given the mandate to rule only if he serves the people well. If he doesn’t, his rule will be stopped (Heaven will take away the mandate and give it to someone new) โ€” even if he has legitimate rights to rule. Heaven will give signs that this mandate is taken away via floods, instability etc. This is different from the European form of succession where it doesn’t matter what’s happening to the common people, but as long as the King has the right DNA, he has the right to rule. (Looks at the current British royal family with a raised eyebrow. Thank God they’re not actually ruling?)

While China is no longer imperial China, this philosophy is baked into the Chinese mind. So Chinese people have more agency than you think. (Another common talking point of Westerners: Chinese people are so oppressed they can’t even speak out against the government. They have not seen Chinese social media, and how heated debates can get!)


The fear of being pro-China

Yet, on a visceral level, I do wonder if I was turning pro-China. I do not want to be on the wrong side of history, so to speak, but is there even a right side in this discussion?

I often watch the people in my circle discuss China. It’ll probably surprise you to know that not all Chinese people have the same thoughts about China.

My more progressive, Western-leaning friends think China is evil and needs to be viewed with great suspicion. (And I find myself censoring myself for fear of being perceived as pro-China.) Then, I have friends that are so pro-China that any remark against China is met with a hiss. (And I just smile and hope they don’t drag me into this conversation.)

I watch this dynamics play out during the 2008 Beijing Olympics. Some of my Chinese colleagues, some who can’t even speak or read Chinese, were going, “China is the most awesome country in the world!”
And there was this one lone Chinese woman wearing a shirt condemning China for her human rights violations.

Even back then I refused to take sides because I knew China should be praised for her achievements in the Beijing Olympics, but her habit of detaining people without trial goes against my ethics.

So, if you’re wondering where I stand in the China debate, it’s somewhere in the middle, the hapless child between two battling parents, understanding both but knowing that intervening would mean a lot of trouble.

Yet, here I am, trying to give a more nuanced view about China. I’m mad, seriously. Like my mum said, there are better and mentally healthier things to be obsessed about!

And when I listen to South-East Asian thought leaders about China, I can’t help but wonder why my beliefs aligned with theirs almost perfectly. Is it because I’m a genius? (Hah!) Or is it because being a South-East Asian Chinese who lived the Chinese culture and yet, am exposed to Western thought all my life, I have formed a view that is unique to this part of the world? Am I just reading these people to confirm my bias??

I guess I’ll never know!

All I know is to claim that there’s a perfectly fair or “right” view of China is laughable. Our perceptions and interpretations of current events are all informed by our experiences, cultural upbringing and personalities.

So, am I pro-China or anti-China?

I am pro-peace. I support any geopolitical move or country that supports that.

That’s all.

Featured photo by biyunfei yang on Unsplash


Comments

52 responses to “It’s probably impossible to be neutral about China”

  1. Lee Fife: @liztai I appreciated reading this. Thank you. via universeodon.com

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  2. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @colo_lee thank you for reading and leaving a kind comment ๐Ÿ˜Š via hachyderm.io

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  3. Technically More Ice Than Rock: @liztaiPolarization is incredibly toxic to nuance. Thanks for this post. via realsocial.life

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  4. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @TerryHancock so true!! Polarisation is tearing Malaysia apart too. I want what’s best for the world, and for peace to reign. via hachyderm.io

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  5. Neon: @liztai@hachyderm.io they don’t! But I am failing to come with a better description. (as you can see, I am hungry hahaha. I am gonna cook now – now snails though) @rakyat@hachyderm.io via blahaj.zone

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  6. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon @rakyat like gamey oysters?? That’s how imagine them bwaha via hachyderm.io

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  7. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon @rakyat Gosh, I’d have to dig up my old articles to find out. It was really a terpencil place where there were no proper roads and the busses drove like hellions. Half the time I thought we were going to crash into some bike or bus. We were thorughly traumatised by their bathrooms too lol. But they were immensely proud of their development. We were there to cover their efforts in building a drama/arts school. Quite fascinating stuff. I bet it’s all skyscrapers now. via hachyderm.io

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  8. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon @rakyat in one of my trips to rural China (for work), they proudly served us snails in oil and I tried my best to look enthusiastic. This was way before Beijing Olympics. Always wondered about that town. It’s probably unrecognisable now. via hachyderm.io

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  9. Just another rakyat ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡พ: @liztai Back then I made it a point to learn more about whatโ€™s going on in Thailand and Indonesia haha, since I believe ASEAN countries are woefully undercovered in Chinese media despite being our neighbours. And it really put our own struggles into perspective. Here a lot of us just sit back and think of ourselves as customers who can choose which political coalitions we want like choosing from a menu, when in reality our denocracy is so fragile and not even fully functioning yet.@geraineon via hachyderm.io

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  10. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @rakyat @geraineon Yeah, I never really thought of our democracy as being great. Still such an immature electorate. If I remember correctly, Indonesia’s one is miles ahead. Thailand – I don’t know much about beyond their military-royal problems. via hachyderm.io

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  11. Just another rakyat ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡พ: @liztai Reminds me of a comment I saw a few days ago, when some taiwanese netizens asked their parents questions about the diff between Buddhism and Taoism, their parents just said, donโ€™t ask so much, just pray only la @geraineon via hachyderm.io

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  12. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @rakyat @geraineon “Why you guys make life so difficult aiseh”. via hachyderm.io

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  13. Just another rakyat ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡พ: @liztai My experience as world news editor/translator also shaped my thinking to be a lot more pragmatic than most people lol. Seeing how each countries have their own problems, how their people try to balance idealism with cold-hard realities. Unfortunately it seems like pragmatism is a dirty word on the fediverse haha @geraineon via hachyderm.io

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  14. Neon: @rakyat@hachyderm.io mine is very layman. I just read from different sources with the assumption that every news source is biased in different ways. Ahaha @liztai@hachyderm.io via blahaj.zone

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  15. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon @rakyat A surprising huge number don’t think that way lol via hachyderm.io

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  16. Just another rakyat ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡พ: @geraineon They are all biased, though to different degrees haha. AP definitely feels more biased than AFP or Reuters, for example.@liztai via hachyderm.io

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  17. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @rakyat @geraineon Yeah if it comes between AP and AFP I always choose AFP lol.I also favoured the Asia News Network stuff. SEA and Asian news outlets less drama-rama in their coverage. via hachyderm.io

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  18. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @rakyat @geraineon Tell me about it. All my China posts trigger certain people. Not sure why I keep doing this lollol.Also have good memories of trawling Straits Times to find some good Singapore coverage. Remember a dry day where I had to highlight a squabble over airconds in a HDB project. That was a “bottom of the barrel” day. Made me realise how drama-free they are … or rather how ST goes out of its way to cover no drama lol! via hachyderm.io

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  19. Dendan Setia (Nins): @liztai People (me) call SCMP that post-what happened in HK. The editorial shift is evident not to mention the spiked stories and shifting editorial focus. Lucky the Malaysia correspondents can still cari makan so can still get decent (non-China-related) SEA coverage.@geraineon via mefi.social

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  20. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @cendawanita @geraineon About the HK situation. I was really the side of Westerners about “fight for democracy” during the riots. Then my HK dwelling friends, most who are not pro-China, sat me down and told me what is REALLY happening and I was like. Oh. OH. WOW.Yeah that’s when I realised shit, coverage is skewed … and thus the seeds of doubt was sown lol. via hachyderm.io

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  21. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon as a person who puts together the world news, I get to compare news wires from AFP, AP, Reuters, Al Jazeera, Global China, SCMP. After a while you recognise the “flavor” of each publication and get to compare how each cover the same storiy. Western media very “ideals” driven, Global China Times is surprisingly fact-driven but of course pro-China lah. SCMP seems a little bit more balanced, which is why I surprise people call it pro-China now. Eh, go watch CGTN lah if you want pro via hachyderm.io

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  22. Neon: @liztai@hachyderm.io haha. All the childhood TVB dramas? (But that’s HK). Recent cdramas + family?I think another issue is U.S. discourse tends to be very black and white. That’s why nuance all kelaut via blahaj.zone

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  23. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon I don’t know why they all think like that. It’s so weird that they don’t see the hypocrisy and contradictions. ๐Ÿ˜… I think a few things factored it in for me:- Yup, TVB and Cdramas!- Reading traditional chinese stories (in English!) as a kid (Dad was a big fan of the Strange Tales of Lao Zhi and Justice Bao)- Growing up in JB where I learned to speak Mandarin- Visiting China a few times and seeing it grow in my very eyes- Having friends from China- World news editor experience via hachyderm.io

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  24. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @Tergenev Well yes before you throw the stone perhaps look at various ways the West does the same. Basically we all suck. via hachyderm.io

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  25. Neon: @liztai@hachyderm.io thanks for sharing your thoughts. I personally don’t think it’s necessary to be pro or anti… Because those positions are meaningless (imo!). More meaningful to discuss what is good, what is bad, what is complicated in components (but I acknowledge that the components also feed into each other). My position is also kinda different I guess, in that I feel absolutely zero connection to China, having grown up in that PJ/Bangsar English speaking anglophone bubble… I jokingly tell people who ask me about allegiance or whatever (to U.S.? to china? That’s absolutely nonsense question to me so idk why ppl here ask me, a Malaysian, this), that I will throw both countries in the trash via blahaj.zone

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  26. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon You and me are the same. Somemore I’m Peranakan lagi tak boleh hahah. But kidding aside, I know more about China and her mindset than I originally thought and that got me wondering how I even knew. via hachyderm.io

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  27. Just another rakyat ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡พ: @geraineon @liztai No one expects us to be pro-Thailand or anti-Thailand or ask us to clarify our stance on South Korea lol. Itโ€™s just other peoples countries in the end and countries are complicated. via hachyderm.io

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  28. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @rakyat @geraineon Why ah why lol. Mum told me to stop asking why, life is hard when you keep asking why lol via hachyderm.io

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  29. Neon: @rakyat@hachyderm.io I am pro Thailand food. Okay okay on Korean food. Too much meat though @liztai@hachyderm.io via blahaj.zone

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  30. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @geraineon @rakyat I am pro every food but snails. It’s their antennas. How they wave about. So geli. via hachyderm.io

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  31. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @cendawanita @geraineon Having worked in a govt-controlled press this sounds familiar lol. Yeah, I have no doubt this is happening too. via hachyderm.io

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  32. oceaniceternity@sakurajima.moe: @liztai I read your article. It is… interesting. I must say: ignoring human rights abuses simply because all countries have a spotted past or present seems disingenious to me. Criticism of those things that are worthy of criticism is the duty of a free and open press.The concept of a autocratic ruler that must respect the wishes of the people is not unique. The first thought that comes to my mind is Cromwell’s dismissal of the Rump Parliment… “Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation; you were deputed here by the people to get grievances redressโ€™d, are yourselves gone!”I do admit that where it comes to looking at places like China, one must actually use their critical thinking skills. As you pointed out there are heated debates. Moreover, sometimes it is more important to listen to what is not being said, instead of what is being said. (This is something that I wish was applied more to the West’s political discussions as well… but is especially important when looking at China).Ultimately, I don’t believe that it is relevant to be pro or anti China. Because there is a more important question that everyone must answer first.Do you like money?China has a lot of money, a large amount of industry, a population that desires luxory goods, and also tourism: in short, good relations with China can be very rewarding. And I believe that is the most important consideration when any discussion of China is made, and any other considerations are largely window dressing and distraction from the central debate.Because often, when you look at countries outside of America… there is a choice. Does this country pursue closer trade relations with China or America?And very often, China is the answer. via sakurajima.moe

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  33. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @oceaniceternity I don’t think we can ignore human rights abuses in China, the US or anywhere else. But let’s be fair and say that every nation commits it and need to fix theirs before accusing others of the same. And of course nations will form trade relations with China! Even the US continues to trade with China. SEA had been trading with China for 2000 years and they will resent being forced to choose. via hachyderm.io

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  34. Neon: @liztai@hachyderm.io I like gamey and I like oysters, so that checks out! @rakyat@hachyderm.io via blahaj.zone

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  35. JeSuisUnHombre: @liztai I’m not going to claim to be incredibly informed, but you didn’t do much to sway the needle towards pro China for me. The things you mentioned about China was mostly bad things, the only “good” was getting lucky with leaders (even though Xi silences critics and has consolidated power) and some religious thing. And the only counter to the bad things was straight whataboutism. I’m allowed to be critical of China when I’m consistently critical of the same in my own and other countries. via mastodon.social

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  36. Elizabeth Tai :verified:: @JeSuisUnHombre of course! My aim is not to convince you to be pro China but to be more nuanced in the debate. And I am not pro-China ๐Ÿ˜… why would you think I am trying to sway you to “the other side”? via hachyderm.io

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  37. […] It’s probably impossible to be neutral about China. (web) […]

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  38. I think this is a pretty common assessment for most countries, especially for those we hail or have ties to.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Yeah, although logically I know I don’t have many things in common with Han Chinese, I’m Chinese enough to relate to them. It’s tough to divorce yourself completely from the “motherland” so to speak. But that doesn’t mean I’m automatically sympathetic to their governance methods ๐Ÿ˜›

      Liked by 2 people

  39. Western media reports about China are sometimes biased.

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  40. […] that China is indeed an evil empire. But if you’ve been reading my latest posts, namely this and this, you’ll probably backpedal hard – either from me, or from that smile you were […]

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